95. A New Approach to Independent School Financial Aid with Jen Danish

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Aubrey: Welcome to Mindful School Marketing. I’m Aubrey Bursch. 

Tara: And I’m Tara Klaes. Today I’m excited we’re joined by Jennifer Danish. Jen is entering her ninth year as head at Grace Episcopal Day School. She’s been in independent schools for over 30 years, beginning just out of college in boarding schools as a teacher, coach, and dorm supervisor.

She believes in the power of nurturing and inclusive school communities to change the lives of students, teachers, and parents. Welcome, Jen. Thanks for joining us. 

Jen: Thank you so much for including me. I’ve been following this podcast since it started and I’m really honored to be here. Thank you. 

Aubrey: Oh, and we’re so excited and honored you’re here with us.

So thanks for joining us. Um, I’m really looking forward to, I know Tara is as well, to learning more about Grace’s new tuition model. I think this is a fascinating topic, but before we do that, um, what would you say sets Grace apart from other schools? Can you give us a sense of the mission and like the values of your school?

Jen: Yes, 

Aubrey: thank you so 

Jen: much for asking that question. Grace has been a school in the independent DC market for over 60 years. So we’ve been around a while and we started like a lot of schools as a school for young, the youngest children. I think an important historical fact about Grace’s founding, though, is that it was founded during integration.

So 1959 60 and You know it inspirationally was not meant to be a school that was for white flight, but really one that was a school for children of all races and religions and being located in Silver Spring, which is one of the most diverse areas in the country. It has had a long history of that kind of inclusion and rich diversity as a school.

And so, um, it then expanded its, its campus, its footprint over to Kensington, and we’re on an 11 acre campus there. And, you know, we find ourselves today in 2024, still really focused on the experience of young children. And we want to create a really beautiful and inspirational environment for them to be curious and to drive their own learning.

Uh, we, we call ourselves the experts in the wonder years because we’re a school that actually ends at fifth grade. I think we’re one of the only schools I know of that ends at fifth. And I think there’s some intentionality there because it really, Allows us to focus on those wondry years and on that deep curiosity that that our youngest children have.

Um, again, we find ourselves as a very diverse school. We’re not a majority white school and, um, that is something we’re really delighted and proud of. And we embrace. I think we also draw a lot of families who maybe didn’t think that they would ever choose a private school and independent school for their children.

They were really In a great county with wonderful public schools that they realized that they needed something different for their children, maybe something smaller, more nurturing. And they might also be drawn to some of our, our pedagogy, which really, again, believes in the capacity and the wonder of children and wants to create a space where that can be just nurtured and really explode in the ways that it should when you’re young.

But just a few things about, about who we are as a school.

Tara: It’s wonderful. I, I just love. Your story, Jen, and, um, full disclosure, having worked with you now for many years, I can attest to, um, to that’s the way you operate with everyone that you work with, not even just the families in your school and your students. So, um, I admire you so much, um, and so happy to have you here to talk about this new community tuition model.

Um, and I know you’ve worked with me and, um, and Adit Berry on this to get it out there, um, on your website and, um, Um, and other materials. So I’d love for you to share just sort of the story what inspired this community tuition model on what it’s all about. 

Jen: Thank you so much. And I, I do, um, want to say just a shout out to a deep Barry, but also to you, Tara.

I think schools are, we’re so lucky to have partners who can help us really leverage and market the stories of our, of our places. And I appreciate all the support you’ve given us. And we did work with Adit. To do some focus groups and some real thinking about our mission and our program, which actually as an as an actual approach to helping families access independent education is is actually not a new thing for us.

We started this program in my third year at Grace and we called it variable tuition and we had studied other models like this across the country. I think Manhattan country day might have been one of the very first. To come up with a model like this. And the notion is that instead of thinking about families in terms of their need.

We’re thinking more about how to create a tuition that makes that education accessible for them, but also makes them equal partners in a community of learners and parents. And I should also disclose that in that 30 years of work, um, I spent, um, 14 years at another school in D. C. where I was actually Director of Admission and Financial Aid.

So I had watched over many years the way that our tuitions were rising in independent schools. Necessarily, we’re trying to pay teachers and give them great salaries and run really bespoke programming. Um, but there’s a little bit of a conundrum that we face as independent school leaders because we’re making our education not as accessible to as many people, um, unless we have really robust financial aid, which is what a lot of schools do have.

But I think it can also feel like, you know, maybe 80 percent of families are paying a very high tuition, and then a smaller number have need. And they can feel I think a little bit on the outside Of an experience based on the price tag that they’re um being given so the the inspiration the the core, um impetus for creating this program was Really to change the way the culture feels.

Um, and and actually for grace, it wasn’t much of a change It was more of an embracing who we are and uplifting this as part of the invitation to join the grace community So You know, it’s a model that is really in the community tuition is born out of some real thinking and conversation with families who are part of of grace and who have appreciated the discount tuition that they have received to attend the school.

And with the deep and a lot of thinking and a lot of back and forth. She I would say she really did a lot of good interviews and thinking on her own. It’s her. It’s her language that that came up with this idea of community tuition. And we’re so grateful because it’s a model that’s helping us build. An inclusive community and one that really centers and strives for that belonging, which is kind of the mountaintop of a diverse and equitable community.

So it’s it’s something that, you know, we’ve been practicing for a while, but as we Lean in with more, um, we really, really want to bring some crispness to the way we think about this so that it’s clear to families that we’re building a community with the actual way that we structure the tuition. Um, I should also say that another commitment we have as a board and school or a small school, um, we’re trying to keep our tuition at the beginning at a sort of a lower place.

It’s, it’s, it’s not the most competitive tuition in the area, but it’s, it’s not at the sort of high, high end of. Of price tag. Um, and you know, again, I think that’s because we’re really focused on program and teaching as our core expense. Um, and then it also allows us to to be mindful of of this, making this a core part of our bringing families to grace.

Aubrey: Thank you so much for sharing, Jen. I’m fascinated by this and I love, I love the title of Community Tuition Model. I think that is just so inviting for people. Um, I’m curious though, could you dive deeper into like, what does like a Community Tuition Model look like? Like, how do people use it? And then also, how does this differ from traditional financial aid programs?

Jen: So, um, there’s some ways in which it’s, it’s quite similar. So a family, um, you know, there’s a published tuition on our website And there’s also a lot of language about community tuition and explains kind of the the philosophy that i’ve just laid out Um, but everybody who is interested in not paying the full price tag that’s listed Applies for um community tuition and it’s a similar um, uh You Software that’s families used to apply for financial aid.

So, um, we use tads and families go in and they, they offer some of their financial information. And then grace has, we have a set of, you know, a set of they’re, they’re not, they’re not super precise, but we have some tiers of different discounts that we offer and we, um, strive to make sure that a family is given a tuition that meets.

It meets their need that they can that they can access. Um, and, and then we, we build and construct the year and the new families around those tiers. And, um, it’s not a perfect bell curve. But again, as I described, it’s not sort of the, uh, Say 20 percent of families who are getting a package, a financial aid package.

It’s much more like 80 percent of families at Grace are getting some kind of discount across a whole number of tiers. So it’s, um, and, and there’s the philanthropy that’s a part of this too, to close some of the gaps. If let’s say the full pay families who are paying that full price tuition, that, that group is, can be a smaller group, but we try to close our gaps on expense with.

Tuition alternative revenue. So we have a big summer camp. We rent our space to a couple which are the one that’s family high school part of our space and we um We do some fundraising. So all of those things are allowing us to commit to this particular approach, but hopefully that explains it a little better.

Tara: Yes, yes, for sure. Thank you. What’s been the community’s response, um, to this more inclusive approach and, um, have you faced any challenges in implementing it? I’m wondering how you’ve addressed any challenges that you faced. 

Jen: No, that’s a great question. I mean, I think, um, When we first rolled it out a number of years ago, when it was called variable tuition, um, we went to, of course, to our, our current families first.

And I think there was a little bit of confusion, like, how is this going to change the price that I pay? And when we were able to explain that it wouldn’t, but it’s more about, um, the way we talk about it. The, the, the tuition that you pay is your equal contribution. It’s not that you have need and we’re feeling that need that the sort of a shift of kind of, um, mindset and it was actually really well received there.

There were a few sort of questions, but it, in some ways it was kind of a seamless transition and then to move to community tuition. Again, I think it feels like we’re just going to sort of a higher. Level of understanding about what it is that we’re striving to create. Um, And again, I think we feel really strongly about the notion of belonging.

It’s actually in our mission statement. The last word of our mission statement is belonging. Um, and that commitment to, to the way you feel as a parent invested in your child’s education is paramount. Um, and so I think it, it really hasn’t, I appreciate the question. I just, I don’t think it’s, it’s been so challenging.

I mean, certainly at the board level, we have to balance the budget and keep sort of thinking through how as a small school, we continue to thrive institutionally, but our strategic plan is, is very focused on those things. So probably at that level is where the challenge has been. How do we make sure we, we can accomplish all that we want to accomplish, um, financially.

But I think otherwise philosophically, it just, it aligns with who we are. So that makes it a pretty easy. moves. 

Aubrey: Thanks so much for sharing Jen. Um, you know, as you know, you’re, we’re the mindful school marketing podcast, so we do focus on marketing as well. So I’m curious. So, um, can you kind of describe a little bit about like, how has grace approached like communication and messaging and marketing of this community tuition program?

I feel like this is a great opportunity, right? Um, would you say it’s a unique selling point? I’d love to hear kind of your thoughts on this. 

Jen: You know, honestly, in many ways, um, it’s all about marketing, right? Because, as I mentioned earlier, so many families in our geography who are seeking a school option.

Are have started out in the public school or have assumed that they were going to use Montgomery County public schools such a strong school system, and they’ve determined actually their child needs a little more touch a little more support and they and they want to be in a in a community like this one.

But they they’ve they’ve sort of just convinced themselves that they can’t afford it. And so what we’re trying to do with our approach is to sort of interrupt that thinking. And, and maybe and give them an invitation to consider actually maybe this could be something I could afford. And how do I go about finding that out?

And what does that look like? So it’s, it’s very much about, um, reaching a market that may have sort of, um, You know, moved itself out of the thinking that it could be in an independent school community. So, um, it, to me, it, it’s, it’s a hundred percent marketing. 

Tara: Is it something that you lead with? Absolutely.

It’s, 

Jen: it’s, um, it’s, it’s all a part of the admission process. And, um, we, we talk about it very transparently. Um, families will, will sometimes, um, come to us and say, you know, I just, I’m not sure this is something we can afford. Um, and then we, We jump right into that conversation. But I, I also think that, um, the, the language that Adit has helped us bring to life on the website and Tara, your support too, and, and, and making sure that families can find the information about cost.

Cause that’s often the first question, right? And, um, there are a lot of, we’re doing a little bit more, um, search engine work, um, on Google and so on. And, you know, a lot of times families go to the tuition page and then they leave. Because they look at 50, 000, which is not what we charge, but that’s kind of a going rate for independent school, and they decide they can’t afford it.

So we want to make sure we keep them on the site a little longer to see if it’s something actually that they could, and we want to invite them into our community. 

Tara: Yeah. Yeah. We had, uh, Dale Seabury as a guest talking about tuition pages and just the opportunity to make those more robust and not just put the numbers out there.

So yeah. Exactly. I see you’re doing that. You’re doing that yourselves. Um, Jen, how do you see community, the community tuition model shaping the future of independent schools? Um, and how could schools start to, you know, explore this process themselves for their school? Yeah. Okay. 

Jen: You know, I, I do think there’s a trend, um, nationally to, to be really thoughtful about the tuition piece.

Um, and there’s lots of different ways that I, I see that happening. I, I will, I will also give a shout out to NEIS that’s been really supportive to me over the years as a head of school and thinking about this. Mark Mitchell, who’s the vice president for access and affordability. Um, he’s done so much good thinking and writing about financial aid and independent schools and cost.

Um, There’s a lot of good data out there. When we when we were exploring this in my third year, we did a lot of research of the schools nationally that had taken on such an approach, and we really tried to look at what happened to enrollment. What happened to net tuition revenue? Like, how did the expense line, um, Did it go down?

Did it go up? Was it flat? And we noticed actually that the trend was was quite positive. And so that data was really an important part of our own process to explore this. There’s also schools that are doing tuition resets, so they’re really looking at what’s the cost really to educate each pupil in our school.

And then how might we readjust and change some of the budgeting mechanism wholesale? To really make the school the tuition more affordable. Um, you know, we’re the only independent school in the DC market that’s taken this approach. And we’re proud of that. Um, but I, I’m also, I’m really, I find that there are lots of partners nationally and other markets that have had great success with this approach.

So I guess my advice to those out there considering it would be to, to reach out to, you know, your peers across the country. And, and, and I’ve done a lot of interviews with. Other heads and business managers across the area. Um, or outside the area and it’s helped me. So I think there’s there’s good information to draw from to make sure it’s the right decision for your school and what is the right move for your school if tuition and affordability or something that that’s that’s causing some concern at the board level.

Aubrey: Thanks. This is fascinating. I really think that I mean, when I, when I work all only with small independent private schools, so this is a conversation piece that comes up, um, especially as, you know, I’m getting back survey results that says the tuition rises every year, and I don’t know how long I’ll be able to stay at this school or something like that.

So I feel like this is a very relevant topic right now, and certainly will be in the future as well. So thank you for sharing that. And I love the idea of like, yeah, gathering information. There are other schools you’re, you know, in, in your area, as well as across the nation and across the world who are like doing these things and this work.

So finding those resources and, and helping each other and learning. True. Thank you. Absolutely. Absolutely. Um, I’m going to shift our conversations a bit to mindfulness, which is also part of our podcast. So, uh, when we’re thinking about mindfulness, we usually think about how it applies to school leaders, independent schools, you know, when you’re thinking about mindfulness, like how do you define it and like, how does it apply to your work?

You know, it could be with the community tuition model or just your work as a school leader. I’d love to hear. 

Jen: Yeah, no, I really appreciate that. That’s a piece of your work and something that’s also really important to me. We’ve done a lot of mindfulness work with our students at grace. Um, find it to be just one of our most powerful tools to help them regulate and, um, be present and they’re in their day.

I also really feel as a school focused on these wonder years. I really try to help parents. Stay in the present with their children and not be too concerned about sixth grade ninth grade college and it’s hard. It’s very hard in this area in particular. Um, but I think the other way I would the other mindset that I really have come to love and appreciate is to access wonder.

As much as possible. So, um, when I’m at recess with, with the kids and I am allowed, you know, I, I’m K I’m I’m awake enough to see the hawk that flies over the playground and we all kind of stop and just take a moment to feel some awe to me, that is my greatest. access to being mindful. Um, and then a follow on to that, I’ve taken on a new project this year, which is that I’m raising a, a guide, a future hopeful guide dog.

And he’s, he’s lying here next to me asleep in his crate. Um, Pancho, he’s five months old. Um, and I’m working with the Guiding Eyes for the Blind program, which is an amazing organization. Um, and so working with Pancho and the children. Is the most mindful part of my day. We were actually out for the first time, just actually trying to greet and sit.

And, you know, it was 50 percent successful, but there was a lot of joy. And I just find myself so immersed in teaching this dog, all the things he needs to learn. And the children are helping me and, and I’m introducing them to each other. And so that’s been my, my deep mindful practices. Raising a puppy. Oh, my gosh.

Aubrey: That’s awesome. Yeah. Guide. I, I raised a guiding eyes for the, well, my parents mostly, let’s be honest, I was like 13, but we do that in our family, guiding eyes for the mind. So I understand the work that goes into that. So first of all, thank you for your efforts. And second, I love that you’ve woven that into the like mindfulness, because it’s true.

You do have to kind of be really present. Totally. Yeah. Yep. Awesome. Thank you for bringing that up. 

Tara: Yeah, it’s fabulous. It’s great. I love it. Um, well, we are going to move on to the fun rapid fire questions now, and I’m excited to start this out with our first question, which is if you could put one book as mandatory reading in the high school curriculum, what would it be 

Jen: in a high school curriculum?

Um, I thought more about elementary school, but, um, I’m just going to share a picture book that, that I find just so important and special. It was very important to my children when they were growing up and, um, it’s Ferdinand the Bull. And just this notion of being yourself and that there’s no one way to be a bull or a boy or a girl or a person, um, that message to me is, is one that I really live by.

So I, and I love, I love the story so much. Um, and as a child and as an adult, I, I continue to love it. So that’s the one I would pick. 

Aubrey: I love that. I actually just reread that to my 9 and 12 year old. So, I feel like it’s timeless. It’s very timeless. I mean, I think it was forever. Yeah, it’s like 1940. I don’t know.

Very. I mean, 

Jen: and I think of Ferdinand as sort of the first transgender. mainly lead character in a book in a way, you know, 

Aubrey: non binary. He just wanted to sit under the tree and enjoy the thing. And everyone was like, no, you need to go be a bullfighter. You’re supposed to be a raging bull. Exactly. Oh, that was, Thank you.

I appreciate you bringing that up. That’s a good one. I’ll have to pull it back out this week too, again. Yes. Now, what was one app you couldn’t live without? 

Jen: So, um, it’s gonna be sort of a silly answer, but I, I have sort of a real estate hobby of just like looking at real estate. I, I don’t know, and all over the country, like, and I, I’m dreaming of the next place I might live.

And so I Redfin, I can’t live without Redfin. I look at it every day. That’s 

Tara: funny. I think we were with some friends last weekend and for fun, they go to open houses and my husband and I were thinking, Oh, that’s, that’s, that’s a fascinating hobby. 

Jen: Well, it’s kind of like a virtual open house all the time and also just like different.

Regions and what things cost and I just find it really fascinating. 

Aubrey: Um, Yeah, I liked house hunters. So that show house hunters and like international so it’s kind of like that but in an app I’m, I guess exactly like where do I want to live or what’s going on? What are the real estate prices in this area?

Tara: Totally Yeah, awesome Um, what are you reading right now? 

Jen: So I just picked up. Um And I didn’t know it was a movie but I picked up the book called the young woman in the sea About Trudy Adderall, who, um, swam across the English Channel, the first woman to swim across the English Channel. And I think it’s a follow on to just all the excitement of the Olympics and, you know, these amazing athletes.

And story, just the story of perseverance and persistence. Um, Yeah, I’m really enjoying it. I I’m not so far into it, but I also have a friend who’s a master’s level swimmer and does a lot of endurance swimming. So I gave it to her as a gift and I’m reading it alongside her. So, um, but it’s great so far. 

Aubrey: I love that you have like a mini book club going right there.

That’s right. Yep. Yeah. I think I saw the movie. I’m like, I need my daughter and I need to watch this. This looks inspiring, but I didn’t know there was a book associated with it. So 

Jen: there is. And, um, I love the Diana Nyad story too. Um, when it happened and then the Anna Bening, um, movie was great, but I don’t know.

I just, I’m really, I’m really moved by, um, Stories of physical kind of persistence and perseverance and the metaphors that are wrapped up in that, too. But, um, 

Aubrey: yeah. Thank you for sharing. Um, last question. What is one great piece of advice you’d like us to leave us with? Yeah, I think, 

Jen: um, the thing I always really want to make sure that my students at Grace, our students at Grace, Learn when they’re here is to ask for help.

Um, and so I, I really try to model that, um, in my own, my own work, you know, not, not getting too wrapped up in my own, um, thoughts and, and worries and hubris that I have all the answers, but continually to learn and ask for help. But I, I also want to model that for our families and parents. I’ll be talking about that a lot.

I’m back to school night. I think this current, um, surge in general warning about. Mental health and parents has me really thinking about how can we, um, encourage adults to, to reach out to each other and create connection and collaboration and not feel so lonely and isolated in their, their worry and struggle.

So, ask 

Tara: for help.

Thank you, Jen. It’s been a real treat to have you on. I feel calm and peaceful through the day. I can imagine how your team must feel every day. Thank you so much. Thank you for having me. Where can people 

Jen: find you online? So, um, you can find the GRACE website, www. geds. org, which is our acronym. And then I’m also on LinkedIn.

Um, be sure to check me out there. Um, at Grace Griffins on Twitter and at Grace Griffins on Instagram is our, our school’s Instagram web page. Lots of great photos and stories about our, our, our school life. So 

Tara: great. 

Jen: Thank you. Thank you. Have 

Tara: a great day. 

Jen: Thanks for having me. 

Tara: Take care.