63. What’s Up With Google Reviews For Schools with Charli DeWhitt

[00:00:00] Aubrey: Welcome to Mindful School Marketing, your go-to podcast for personal and professional growth. 

[00:00:06] Tara: We’re school marketers, business owners, and moms passionate about connecting other school professionals with tools and strategies for success. 

[00:00:14] Aubrey: We love solving problems, exploring new ideas, and thinking outside the box.

[00:00:19] Let’s transform your school and life starting right now. 

[00:00:23] Tara: This episode is brought to you by Inquiry Tracker. Easily manage all your inquiries, tours, open houses, and applications with a system designed by K through 12, education, marketing, and admissions professionals. Welcome to The Mindful School Marketing.

[00:00:38] I’m Tara 

[00:00:38] Aubrey: Clays. And I’m Aubrey Burch. Today we’re joined by Charlie dewitt. Charlie is a former director of marketing recruitment and communications for a school network in Indiana, and a current enrollment consultant with School Minutes where she helps schools to attract and enroll more students. She has a passion for helping schools shine a light on amazing things happening in their classroom.

[00:01:01] Welcome, Charli. We’re so excited you’re here. 

[00:01:03] Charli: Thanks. I’m so excited to be here. 

[00:01:05] Tara: Yeah, thanks for joining us. This is a topic of great interest and intrigue, so we’re very excited to dig into it. But first, can you tell us a little bit more 

[00:01:14] Charli: about yourself? Yeah, awesome. I am, uh, former teacher, so started my career teaching pre-K and then high school Spanish, um, decided, um, to venture outside the classroom.

[00:01:26] Um, did some years in technical recruiting and consulting. And then, um, wound up, um, after my daughter was born, um, joining, um, a charter school network here in Indianapolis where I help support, um, recruitment and communications and, um, marketing efforts. And then, um, after a couple years of. Doing that made the switch over to school MIT, where I help, um, other schools right, do the stuff that I’m, I wish I would’ve known how to do when I first started.

[00:01:53] Um, so everything from like training courses to helping with s e o and, um, enrollment microsites, um, all sorts of kind of stuff. And on a personal note, um, where. Um, big outdoors people, so hiking, kayaking, um, big donut fans. So, uh, we have a running, like a running, uh, bracket of the best donut places in, in the Indianapolis area.

[00:02:13] So if you’re ever hungry for a donut, I can, I can hook you up. Um, but yeah, no, that’s, that’s a little bit about me. Wow. 

[00:02:21] Tara: Yeah. Jelly Donuts or any kind. What’s your favorite kind of donut? 

[00:02:24] Charli: Uh, I love, like a good maple donut. My husband, uh, loves the Maple Bacon one, so anywhere that has like a Maple bacon donut is our favorite.

[00:02:32] My daughter got me, uh, she tried like at a place where you go, you make your own, like dip ’em in whatever you want. A maple donut that’s covered in Fruity Pebbles, and it is actually very good. That 

[00:02:44] Aubrey: does sound good. That does really good. Yeah. My kids would be all over that. They’d be like, yes, sign me up.

[00:02:50] Well, okay, so we can come to you for hiking and donuts, is what I’m hearing. That’s 

[00:02:55] Charli: like, I thought you covered, yeah. Yeah, that sounds 

[00:02:58] Tara: great. I made an exception to my websites that I make for schools and I have a donut, uh, shop website because why not? I mean, wouldn’t you love to have a donut shop website?

[00:03:09] Charli: Yeah. 

[00:03:11] Aubrey: Uh, well, I’m super excited. So I had the privilege of communicating with Charlie about an article she wrote about Google Business profile and specifically about Google reviews for schools. And so, um, Charlie, I’m excited to dive, dive into the, really this important topic. Um, So to give a background to our audience, like, you know, Tara and I and Charlie we’re all professionals who work with independent schools on marketing and Google business profiles, which was formerly Google My Business.

[00:03:40] I still sometimes slip up and say it. Um, and like a lot of us are saying, this is one thing that schools should optimize, right? To improve their digital presence. And one part of the Google business profile, an extremely important part is the Google reviews. And as we know, parent and student reviews on platforms like Google Build, that know, like, and trust factor for schools.

[00:04:01] So, um, for those of you wondering if reviews are worth, like if, is this worth. Diving into it is because according to niche.com, they did a great, very robust parent survey. 65% of prospective families said reviews and testimonials from other parents influenced their decision to attend a particular school.

[00:04:19] Yet Google reviews have been a source of tremendous frustration for schools over the past four years. So we’re gonna dive into. A little bit about what’s happening with Google reviews, what you can do about it. Um, and Charlie’s gonna share her knowledge and some of the research she’s been doing. So Charlie, can you share a little bit more about the history of what’s happened with Google reviews and the challenges that schools are currently facing now with Google reviews?

[00:04:44] Charli: Yeah. So, um, when I first started school marketing, right, like it was like, you gotta get your Google reviews, right? When people are looking for schools, they can see ’em right away. Um, they’re really easy to view on your Google business profile. And, um, while SEO is kind of, you know, search engine optimization ranking at the top of the page is one of those things that there’s no magic formula, right?

[00:05:05] And even if there was, Google wouldn’t tell us about it. Um, Reviews were thought to be something that that can really help you rank higher, right? Like a lot of really good quality reviews maybe, right? Like improves your s e o but it definitely improves your public perception. Um, so, uh, I was. Working really hard to get families to leave good reviews.

[00:05:26] You know, anytime they would say like, Hey, we love this school. I’d send them the link to the Google Reviews profile and say, Hey, would you mind, um, doing this? And a lot of families were saying, um, for one of my campuses, they’re like, again, I did that. Like, and I’m like, well, I didn’t see it anywhere. And so I’m like, well, well maybe it just takes a couple days to show up.

[00:05:41] Or maybe, you know, you need a certain amount. Like there’s a threshold I have to meet. So, you know, this started, you know, four years ago, right? Like, it’s been this ongoing kind of like, just like bug in my life that I’m like, gosh, I wish I could figure it out. Um, and so after like reaching out and reaching out and reaching out, I was told it was a policy decision for that school.

[00:06:00] And I was like, well, that’s odd. Just, you know, moved on with my life. Like, ended up prioritizing other sites, like great schools niche, um, Facebook. Um, and now here I am in this role and I see that, um, you know, I do a lot of Google business profile optimization and management for some of our clients, and I was saying that there was some weird patterns of certain schools not being able to host reviews or, um, display even their old reviews or get new reviews, and it was kind of all over the board.

[00:06:30] So I started digging in to try to figure out like what is going on and ended up. Having to go all the way up through the chain of Google technical support to, to figure out, um, you know, what was going on and what we could do, um, to fix it. Which is unfortunately kind of where, where we are now. 

[00:06:47] Aubrey: Yeah. 

[00:06:47] Tara: It’s so frustrating.

[00:06:48] I mean, you, so you just said that you saw a pattern, um, and I’m curious to know what that would be. 

[00:06:56] Charli: Yeah. So the pattern that I, um, started seeing and, uh, when I first noticed it was that new schools were not being able to get reviews. So if I was opening a brand new school and claiming my Google business profile, um, as a school from the get-go, no reviews, we noticed that, um, with most of the new schools were opening.

[00:07:16] So for a while I was like, well, maybe it’s just like a new school thing. Like maybe that’s, or like the first time you claim your account or something, I. That was my biggest guess. Right. Um, now I’ve noticed that, um, it’s affecting, in my limited experience, private schools less, um, and it feels like it’s impacting charter and public schools more.

[00:07:36] Um, but they’re only going off of your, your category, right. So they don’t know, um, you know, just from like your title, right? If you’re a charter public or private school or parochial school. Um, but just from my limited experience, it seems like, um, it’s, it’s, it’s. You know, stretching out now to cover more schools, but when it first rolled out, it felt like to me the charter schools were the ones that were being kind of like shut down first.

[00:08:02] And now I’ve noticed that it’s kind of spreading to, to the majority of our schools. Um, and you know, when I did, I did reach out and I was like, Hey, like this doesn’t seem fair. Right? It doesn’t seem like a good practice to not have it be consistent. And I was told that. You know, a big part of it is that if you’re verified and you are claiming your category, right, you’re saying like, this is, I’m a school.

[00:08:23] Um, that’s usually when this will kick in. So, you know, my question was, well then should we even be verifying these accounts, right? Like, if I leave an unverified, can I get reviews? And ultimately, you know, My assumption is that it’ll end up impacting everyone at some point, and the verification of your Google business profile is, is gonna be worth more in the long run than the ability to have those reviews on Google.

[00:08:45] Um, just for, you know, s e o and, and accuracy and all of that kind of, um, stuff that goes along with what you can do with a verified, um, profile. So, So intriguing. 

[00:08:55] Aubrey: Um, so, you know, I saw the ups and downs, so we work primarily with independent schools. And so what we were seeing was definitely a freeze around like the Covid beginning and, and throughout.

[00:09:08] Yes. And then a lot of them were unfrozen, but no, by the way, yes. There’s never like, You never get an email saying you’re frozen or you’re unfrozen, you actually get no information. Um, so no. And people who need 

[00:09:20] Charli: reviews don’t know either, right? So they’re out there thinking like, I’ve done this complete thing for the school and no one even said thank you to me.

[00:09:27] And that has to be so frustrating. Yes. 

[00:09:30] Aubrey: It is. And I think, you know, it’s interesting. So when I’m looking at my client’s Google business profiles, like I would say 75% are frozen. Um, like they’ve tried to get parent reviews, it’s, it’s definitely not happening. And then there’s that 25% that I’m like, if you still have it, you’re 

[00:09:47] Charli: lucky.

[00:09:49] Yeah. And they’ll use it, right? Yeah. 

[00:09:51] Aubrey: Yes. I like build it up now, but I do wonder, like I. Um, as we’re talking about this, like what, so what do these schools do? So if it is frozen, and I think you’re, you indicated that this might just be a change for good, right? Like change not for good, but change forever.

[00:10:07] Yeah. More permanent change. Like what do schools do? How in the world do they, you know, I know one school has like, had so many positive parent reviews, but then the last four to post were all negative. And so now they’re, that was four years ago and they’re, Stuck with those negative reviews. Yeah. So what are your recommendations for schools in this situation?

[00:10:26] Tara: And can I also add, ask a clarification here too, like when we’re talking about frozen, um, people can still leave reviews in most of these cases, right? There’s still an opportunity to leave them, but they’re not displayed Or is that a whole another situation? Right. Not 

[00:10:41] Charli: they think they’re doing it right.

[00:10:42] Right. Like it’s like you can ha click the writer review button, but ultimately, like nothing happens. Right. Which is, you know, that’s, that’s worse. Yeah. Yeah. Yeah. That’s really frustrating. Um, and like you said, right? We’ve got, we, and I’ve worked with schools too who are like, ha we’ve had, you know, a really rough year, or we just had like, you know, an incident or something and like, okay, no big deal.

[00:11:05] We can get some more positive reviews and kind of change the momentum, right? And it’s like, well now we can’t. Right? Like they pick the worst possible time. To freeze our reviews. Um, and you know, I’ve reached out to Google, I’ve asked about it. Uh, you know, the, the. The line is that there’s been a, a policy in place since 2018 where, um, public institutions and public services, um, like doctor’s offices, hospitals, schools, um, shouldn’t, shouldn’t have these kind reviews.

[00:11:37] They don’t wanna unduly burden them. Right. Which I’m sure we’ve all seen doctor’s offices still have reviews up. Um, I know I left my doctor review. Right. Um, but it seems like schools are the ones that are really, um, getting hammered and like you said, I during covid right. Kind of made some sense. You’re like, okay, people are trying to figure everything out.

[00:11:54] We don’t want these schools to be burdened by, you know, the pandemic on top of everything else. Parents upset about how they’re handling it. Right. Um, but it just seems like, yeah, it’s not going away. And so we need to be strategic, um, and kind of accept the fact that like, it, it feels unfair and it feels bad.

[00:12:14] But we can’t fix it. Right. And there’s no, there’s no real incentive for Google to, to undo these policies, right? Like, we’re not paying customers like it, it is what it is. So, um, my recommendation has been to, um, then take all of your review efforts. And really target, um, the sites that will show up as reviews on your Google Pro profile, on that side panel.

[00:12:37] Um, so those are things like great schools, niche, Facebook, um, especially, um, Facebook’s really nice cuz most people like already have an account, right. And it’s a really quick review process where it’s like, would you recommend it? Yep. And then leave a comment. Um, and then those people, right, their friends see it and they’re like, oh, I trust this person who sends their kid there.

[00:12:55] And, um, I don’t know if anyone. Is part of like local moms groups, but, um, almost like. Invariably every day I’m, I open up my phone and I see, oh my kid, we need to pick a kid school for my kid. Like, where would you recommend? So having that like built up stable reviews native on that platform, um, especially for elementary school families, right, where the moms are in those groups and trying to figure out where they wanna send their kid.

[00:13:20] Um, I think those are really helpful, but again, right grade schools and niche source are also really great resources. Um, and they give a lot more robust information about your school. Um, and your little reviews will be displayed like five out of five from niche, or 3.5 out of five from grade schools.

[00:13:37] Right. On that profile. When people click it, it’ll, they’ll get taken to your, um, your profile site there. So, um, You know, there’s not much we can do in terms of, um, you know, taking reviews down if they’re, if they’re true right and accurate and not, you know, anything that’s totally bananas that you can ask them to take down.

[00:13:55] Um, but we can try to change the tide, right? And if, if, as a parent, right, like I’m on a site and I see, um, most reviews are fine. There’s a couple recent negative ones on Google, but then I go over and see five out of five with 40 people on great schools and like a hundred reviews on Facebook. I’m gonna take those couple negatives with a grain of salt, understanding that it’s a, it’s a snapshot, not a full report.

[00:14:19] Yeah, that 

[00:14:19] Tara: makes sense. Um, I mean, so if, if there are negative reviews, if they’re old and your reviews are frozen, can you 

[00:14:28] Aubrey: reply 

[00:14:28] Charli: to them? In some cases I have been able to reply to old reviews. There have been cases where I’ve tried to reply and my replies don’t show. So I don’t know if that’s a, um, a, like a Google decision on those.

[00:14:40] Once they freeze your account for a certain reason, it’s frozen. Um, I didn’t get much information when I asked, like, that’s a policy decision, um, which. I don’t know what policy it is. Um, if you can reply, I don’t think it’s a bad idea. Um, as, as long as um, you know, obviously you keep it, um, you know, solution oriented and positive and not argumentative, right?

[00:15:03] Because when we start trying to argue facts, um, you know, it doesn’t make anybody look good. Um, but it’s totally fine to say, I’m so sorry you had that experience like, Here’s what we’re doing to help, or please let us know how we can help you moving forward. Um, thanks for sharing, you know, your feedback with us.

[00:15:20] Um, I always think that that’s a fine way to respond, but whether or not it shows up, um, you have to kind of do the work and test it out and figure out if it does or not, which is not, uh, not an ideal answer. 

[00:15:31] Aubrey: Thank you. I appreciate that. I’m curious, like we talk about Google reviews and we talk about they’re potentially frozen on many of these sites.

[00:15:39] How does schools know, like all these schools out there listening to this, like, how do I know if my Google reviews are frozen? Um, what is the step to take? Do they contact Google? Do they test out getting reviews? 

[00:15:52] Charli: Yeah, so that’s a really tricky one. Um, because there’s not an easy way. It’s not like you get like a, like, you know, A Snowflake logo that’s like, Hey, it’s frozen, or anything like that.

[00:16:02] Um, that’d be a good, I I’m gonna message Google, like, that’d be a good idea. Um, oh my 

[00:16:05] Aubrey: gosh, I love that. I’m gonna be laughing about that the whole time. That’s perfect. 

[00:16:09] Charli: Right? Um, the best way, and, and you can always reach out to Google. Sometimes you won’t get an answer for a while, or you’ll get to the wrong department and they’ll have to swap you over.

[00:16:19] You won’t get a clear answer. I think the easiest way to do it is to just create a Google account and try to leave for review and see what happens. Um, If you haven’t had reviews in a while, if, especially if it’s like pre 2018 is the last review you had, um, or if you have people that are saying, Hey, I’m leaving your review and it’s not showing up, most definitely you’re frozen.

[00:16:39] Um, I, very few schools that I work with right now are, are not frozen, so, um, my gut would say you probably are. But if you wanna check, like give it a shot with your personal Gmail or with a have a friend try it. Um, And, and see what happens when, 

[00:16:57] Tara: when it is frozen. Is there anything you can do to like put a little message in your profile that says, Hey, Google has blocked reviews for schools.

[00:17:05] Don’t leave one. Or don’t, if you leave one and you don’t see it, that’s why. Is there any place you can put 

[00:17:10] that 

[00:17:10] Aubrey: message 

[00:17:10] Charli: for people? Yeah, I wish, I wish there was. And really like you could put it in your profile, right? But then you’re giving up some of those, I think, you know, 750. Yeah. Um, you know, words to, to.

[00:17:22] Tell people not to leave your review. Um, I think the better messaging, um, or the more effective messaging from my experience is to when you are reaching out to families to ask for reviews, to say, Hey, Google’s not letting us get reviews. Like, please go to these sites. We’d really appreciate hearing about, you know, um, your experiences with the school.

[00:17:42] School. And, um, an even better tactic that I’ve seen some schools do that I think works really well is, um, specifically targeting those requests, right? Because you don’t need a hundred good reviews, you need like five to 10, right? So, um, reach out to kids who were in, you know, the school play and be like, Hey, Their parents and send ’em a message and say, Hey, I saw Emily in the school play.

[00:18:02] What a great, you know, job. She’s shown so much growth this year. You know, parents like you are trying to make good decisions for kids like Emily, would you mind leaving a review on ni Great Schools? Like, you know, Google’s not allowing us to have them anymore, so these are the best sites for people to learn about our school.

[00:18:17] School, um, and then those families, right? Obviously you took the time to message them and talk about their kid. And anytime anyone talks about my kid, I’m like, oh, I’m, I’m here for it. I wanna hear about it. Um, and then that encourages them to, to then go and do you the favor, right. Of leaving a review. 

[00:18:31] Tara: Yeah, it should be Google’s job to leave a message saying that the 

[00:18:34] Aubrey: reviews are, I feel like it should be too, 

[00:18:36] Charli: right?

[00:18:36] Or at least take that, write a review button down. Because parents were getting like kind of frustrated with me when I was like, um, hey, remember I asked you to do, I’m like, I did that. I’m like, well, it’s not showing up. And then finally it clicked and it’s like maybe the problem’s, not me or the parent, maybe it’s our Google profile.

[00:18:53] Aubrey: Yeah, I, I think Google should have it. Like, there should be a little banner or else take off the reviews. I mean, and that’s gonna lead to the next, so the next set the question, the next question I have, which is, so when you school, when you search schools near me, right. Or private schools near me, or something like that, and your school comes up and now it has Google reviews, like the reviews are frozen and now we’re looking at that three pack, right?

[00:19:18] That’s come up. Yep. Uh, you know, how, what’s the impact on schools like, I mean, that’s a first choice. Like that gives an overall picture to a prospective family about, you know, your school in relation to the other schools in your area that are your competition. And if you have frozen reviews and the last reviews you had were not good, like what is, where 

[00:19:37] Charli: is this leaving schools?

[00:19:40] Yeah. Well it’s gonna be a huge detriment, right? Especially cuz like you said, right, that local three pack or if you’re on a map right? And looking like what schools are closest to me, you get like, The name, the address and the stars, right? Like, those are kind of like the, the three things you, you see first when you’re looking.

[00:19:56] Um, and so if you are a school that even if you just have one bad review, right? And you’re just one, one star, um, Parents aren’t usually gonna click down to dig and be like, oh, it was only one, it was three years ago, and they just seemed like maybe they were having a bad day. Um, so it really is detrimental to schools.

[00:20:14] Um, and I wish that there was like an easy fix that I could say, but here’s how, what you can do about it. Right? And, um, and I haven’t been able to come up with anything and I’m, I have tried to think outside the box as much as I can, um, and work with Google. Um, and unfortunately it just seems like something that’s.

[00:20:31] That’s just gonna be unfair, right? And so in those situations, what I’d say is you then have to do double the work, right? To get your website to, to, to rank as high as possible in addition to your Google business profile. So that that’s not the only thing families see when they’re searching. Um, and that you get those ni niche in grade schools reviews and Facebook reviews as high as you can get them.

[00:20:53] Hopefully those parents will click and learn a little bit more. Um, but other than, you know, Trying to get them hidden, right, which Google is pretty, pretty hesitant to do, which for good reason, right? We don’t want businesses being able to hide everyone, star review. They get, um, we want everyone to be accountable, but, um, you know, reach out to Google and ask like, Hey look, could we just get reviews, all the reviews taken down for this account since we can’t get new ones?

[00:21:21] Um, that feels like something that might be more, uh, more likely to happen than trying to get your reviews reopened. I wanna 

[00:21:29] Tara: also kind of dig in a little bit to then what the importance of Google business profile is. I mean, should, should to not give up on it, right? Even though the reviews are not working, if you can get those taken down, um, do you think it’s still relevant for marketing?

[00:21:46] Charli: Oh, it’s su it’s super relevant, um, especially because as we know, most schools are local searches, right. So, um, when I’m searching for a school for my kid, I’m looking here where I live in Noblesville, um, I’m not looking, you know, in Chicago. Right. So, um, those local packs on the map, right? Your, where your Google Business profile ranks.

[00:22:05] Um, That’s hugely important to your school, right? Those are the first things that people see when they’re looking, um, for searches like school near me, private school near me, kindergarten, near me, right? All of those searches are gonna, um, pop up at the top, those local searches. So, um, it’s still really important.

[00:22:21] You want it to be filled out. You want accurate information. Um, you know, I’ve seen a lot where there’s duplicates of schools, right? Where they started in one space and moved, and now there’s. Two addresses and different phone numbers. Um, and we just wanna make it easy for families to make a good decision.

[00:22:36] And in order to make it easy for them to engage with you, they have to be able to find you and find your accurate contact information. So, um, verify your, your Google business profile. Make sure you got the right main category and secondary categories cuz those will definitely impact where you show up in searches.

[00:22:53] Um, and you know, something, just a little trick for Google business profiles that I’ve. Um, just experimented my way into is a lot of times, especially, um, uh, with, with private and charter schools, their name doesn’t have what they are in it, right? So they’ll call themselves something, right? Like, um, you know, like St.

[00:23:15] Mary’s and you’re like, well, okay, you’re school, but no one Googling is gonna know that. And Google’s also looking at that and saying like, this doesn’t seem like a school, right? Like, it’s just called St. Mary’s. So. Put in there like St. Mary’s, you know, Catholic elementary school or you know, like minty stem charter school.

[00:23:33] That way, um, you know, you’re more likely to, to pop up for those like, like keyword searches of like school near me, Catholic school near me. Um, I found that that’s really helpful and even just doing that can make someone pop from like the 10th to the second place. Like that, just, um, it happens really quickly.

[00:23:50] So clean your profiles, name them, um, things that make sense, like for people searching. Right? Um, and then also don’t forget to, to make sure your categories are set appropriately. So, Uh, 

[00:24:01] Aubrey: I’m so glad you gave those tips. Um, I love reviewing people’s Google business profile schools because it’s so many are underoptimized, right?

[00:24:10] And there’s so much potential with this free tool. You know? Yes, we’re frustrated with the reviews, but still like there’s so many options with the services, the products piece, the. The being able to update or feature events 

[00:24:24] Charli: you Yeah. Yeah. I know the 

[00:24:25] Aubrey: booking links and there’s so many, and I’m seeing even more changes that Google’s rolling out.

[00:24:30] There’s some really interesting things that’s happening with the Google business profile. Um, but it’s just, if we just spent like 30 minutes, like. Every month just working on the Google business profile. I think it would go a long way for schools cuz it’s definitely underutilized. Um, and it’s free. I’m wondering if you see, yes, it’s free, free paying for it.

[00:24:51] Um, so thank you for those tips. I really appreciate that. Now, um, I’m gonna transition our conversation to, um, as you know, we’re called the Mindful School Marketing Podcast. So we do talk about mindfulness, um, and how it applies to marketing in schools. So how would you define Mark Mindfulness and how do you see it lived out in the work you do with schools and also personally, 

[00:25:11] Charli: professionally, I.

[00:25:12] Yeah, so I’m, I’m a yogi at heart, so mindfulness is right up my alley. Um, but you know, for me, mindfulness is just be about being authentic and aware and present in what you’re doing. Um, and, you know, being, um, really cognizant of. The fact that the actions and the choices that you make have an impact on other people.

[00:25:32] Um, and I think as a parent, right, like who’s recently been through the process of like picking a school for my child, um, you know, having that, that in your mind of, of. The choices that I make on behalf of these schools and for these schools doesn’t just impact the schools, right? And my company, there are real people out there trying to make real decisions for their families on where they send their kids to school.

[00:25:56] So I need to make sure that, um, you know, I’m doing my job of. First of all, marketing. Well, like, I want them to be successful, my clients, but I also wanna make sure that they’re marketing in the right way, to the right people at the right time to, um, you know, enroll the students that are gonna be successful and, and, and want to be there.

[00:26:13] Um, so that’s always kind of in the back of my mind of, you know, um, all of our clients. Re great schools. I’m not, you know, um, uh, I’m not concerned about about their students, but it is something to keep in mind where it’s like, well, if, if I’m, you know, working with a STEM school, like I wanna make sure that I’m representing them in the right way to the right people.

[00:26:31] Um, so that when people show up and they’re like, but I really love orchestra. Um, you guys don’t have that. No one’s disappointed. Right? Um, I always think that that’s really, really important to be intentional about, and that’s something that, Um, can sometimes get in the way right of your, of your professional goals when you’re like, oh, I wanna get, you know, 400 new students.

[00:26:49] And it’s like, well, do I want 400 new students or do I want maybe 350 students that are gonna stay because they’re the right fits? Um, so that’s kind of what I think of when I think of how mindfulness plays into school marketing. Yeah. 

[00:27:01] Tara: Thank you so much. That so much. Yeah, exactly. That’s excellent. I appreciate it.

[00:27:08] Um, so we are gonna move on to our rapid fire questions now, which are really fun little questions we ask at the end of every episode. And the first one is my favorite, which is if you could put one book as mandatory reading on a high school reading list, what 

[00:27:24] Charli: would it be? So I thought so hard about this, um, and I couldn’t come up with an answer.

[00:27:30] And I think it’s because I truly detested assigned reading in school. I felt like I was always reading stuff that didn’t, like, didn’t jive with me. And I had a teacher who we were reading a terrible assigned book, I can’t even remember what it was. No one was into it. I was an A student and still wasn’t reading it.

[00:27:44] Like I just can’t do it. And he like, looked at the class and was like, do you guys hate this book? And we’re all like, yeah, it’s awful. And he goes, we shouldn’t read it. He goes, reading should be fun. This isn’t fun. No one likes it. Go pick another book and do a book report on that. And I, um, read Pride and Prejudice and it became like my favorite book, um, because I liked it and I picked it for myself.

[00:28:04] Um, and I think that kickstarted like a very, um, long, uh, you know, lifelong love of of reading. Cause I’d always thought reading was kind of like, You know, with the exception of Harry Potter, right? Like, it was kind of boring. You had to read Shakespeare and things that didn’t feel applicable to my life. So, um, shout out to, to Mr.

[00:28:21] Beasley for, for canceling assigned reading. We always remember those teachers, right? 

[00:28:27] Aubrey: We always remember them. Right? Absolutely. I felt the same way about my high school reading list. I was like, this is a very depressing list. 

[00:28:34] Charli: Like horrible things happen in these 

[00:28:36] Aubrey: books. Is there no optimistic, like positive outcome?

[00:28:40] Um, so I, that’s funny that you brought, I very appreciate that the 

[00:28:43] Charli: language is hard, right? Like when you’re like, you’re like, I don’t understand half of what’s happening. Like, and also like the cultural stuff from 300 years ago. My, I don’t know what, what this means, like, 

[00:28:54] Aubrey: oh my gosh. Yes. Well, thank you for, for that.

[00:28:57] I really appreciate that. Now, I’m curious about the answer for this next question. What 

[00:29:01] Charli: is one app you couldn’t live without? Oh, but it’s not an app. I’m gonna, I’m gonna change the question a little bit, but I have been using chat, G P T. Uh, it has an app function, so it’s kind of an app, but um, I am obsessed with it.

[00:29:16] I did a whole training on ways schools, marketers, School marketers can use AI ethically. Um, and I, uh, I love it. My husband’s a, that’s his jam. He’s like a machine learning software engineer, and we geek out over all the time. It writes my daughter’s bedtime stories every night. I like tell it to write a story about Daisy joining.

[00:29:34] Oh 

[00:29:35] Aubrey: my gosh, that fabulous. It’s amazing. That’s the most creative use I’ve heard of, 

[00:29:42] Charli: I’ve heard for a while. That’s awesome. Well, I showed my mom a kindergarten teacher and I showed her how to use it cuz she’s like, I’d love to write stories about my kids. And I’m like, here you go. Just give it a list and tell it what you want it to write about.

[00:29:51] And she’s like, are you kidding me? Um, it’s so cool. It’s really, really, really cool. That’s awesome. You know. People have debates about the ethics of it, and there are, there are totally reasonable concerns, but, um, there are also really great ways to use it to just make your life better, um, and, and be better at your job.

[00:30:08] And, uh, you know, add some fun in right with some, some fun bedtime stories. Yeah, 

[00:30:13] Aubrey: that 

[00:30:13] Tara: is really neat. I’ve used it too. We, we chatted with the guest, um, who talked about that, but I’d love for you to share in the show notes, um, if it’s available, um, what you put together as well. Yeah. Yeah. That was really neat.

[00:30:24] Um, okay, next question. Since you told us that you love reading, even though not, you’re not mandatory reading, what are you reading 

[00:30:30] Charli: right now? Yeah. Um, yeah, so I do a lot of travel, so I do a lot of audio books. I just finished, um, a lesson in chemistry. I thought it was wonderful. Um, and I just started, um, it’s called Sensational and it’s a, um, uh, true story of um, uh, stunt reporters who the girl investigative reporters back in the day, um, when women weren’t really encouraged or, um, you know, allowed to kind of do those kind of jobs.

[00:30:53] So, um, I’m only a couple minutes in, um, but it seems really good so far. 

[00:30:59] Aubrey: That sounds like a great topic. We have like that Rebel Girls book where we read about all the amazing, like women that came before us. Yes. I’m like, oh my gosh, there’s so many women who did such hard things. So I love, I love like a, I never heard about them 

[00:31:13] Charli: until you picked up this like book at 

[00:31:15] Aubrey: Barnes and Noble.

[00:31:16] Yeah. Oh, thank you for sharing that. Um, what is one great piece of advice you’d like to leave 

[00:31:22] Charli: us with? Oh, that’s a good question. Um, I think, um, you know, the. As it relates to this job, um, you know, there is no such thing as someone who’s an expert in school marketing, right? There’s no, there’s no degree in it.

[00:31:37] Um, I see all the time so many people with like imposter syndrome, right? Who take our training course where they’re just like, I’m not good at this. I don’t know what I’m doing. I’m overwhelmed. And, um, you know, most of those people are, are doing a good job, right? And that they have creative ideas. So I think for anyone that’s doing this type of work, my advice is, you know, learn from people who have done it.

[00:31:59] Before, right? Like, take what you need, um, give back what doesn’t serve you. Um, but also like, don’t, don’t, uh, let your, your fear or, uh, you know, feeling inadequate, stop you from trying new things and learning marketing’s all about failing, right? If everything I did worked, um, I would be a millionaire, right?

[00:32:18] Like, um, half of the stuff we try doesn’t work and then you try something else and it does. So, um, I think my advice is just to, you know, It’s so cheesy, but like, I guess believe in yourself and, um, uh, you know, don’t let that fear of not being good enough or not having the right degree or the right experience keep you, um, from enjoying your job and, and doing, doing 

[00:32:39] Aubrey: a good job.

[00:32:40] Tara: That’s awesome. Thank you so much Charlie. We really loved having you on the show today. Where can people find you 

[00:32:46] Charli: online? The best place to connect with me is on LinkedIn. Um, you can find me Charlie dewitt. Thank 

[00:32:51] Aubrey: you again, Charlie. This was amazing. I really appreciate this conversation. I know our 

[00:32:55] Charli: school audience will as well.

[00:32:57] Oh, I’m so glad. It was great chatting with you. Inquiry Tracker is the 

[00:33:01] Aubrey: all-in-one C R M solution used by over 250 schools. Easily manage all your inquiries, tours, 

[00:33:07] Charli: and open houses. Key Instant 

[00:33:09] Aubrey: Analytics help you manage and grow a robust pipeline, so end spreadsheets forever. 

[00:33:15] Tara: The Smart Online Application System with Powerful Document Upload is a game changer.

[00:33:20] No school is too small or too big, and their Fast Start program will get you up and running in no time. Best of all the 

[00:33:26] Aubrey: system is designed by K through 12 education, marketing, and admissions professionals. Check out inquiry tracker, inquiry tracker.net. That’s inquiry with an e tracker.net. Thanks for 

[00:33:38] Tara: joining us on the Mindful School Marketing Podcast.

[00:33:41] Aubrey: We’d love it if you pop into iTunes and leave up review five Star Preferred. Let us know how you like the show. It helps us improve what we’re doing and helps others find us too.